No, ColGene, your polysci professor lied to you. Democracy is based on the principle of majority rule. The people of Afghanistan VOTED for this government, they VOTED for its laws. That we are blessed with a democracy that DPES recognize those freedoms is a fact for which I am eternally grateful.

I'm confused as to what exactly it is you want, Col. A few months ago you complained because we are forcing our way of life on Afghanistan, now you're complaining because we're not making Afghanistan into a puppet regime. I don't like what we're doing here any more than you do, but the simple truth is, we must allow this new government to make their own mistakes or they will always be dependent upon us for support.

What is beginning to sadden me, Col, is that you don't even have a political identity. Your entire life seems to be focused solely on your utter hatred for President Bush. It's odd, really.

lol... a sad justification of the American need to impose our values on the world. We don't certify your country as a democracy unless you adopt our ideals.

"Main Entry: the·oc·ra·cy Pronunciation: thE-'ä-kr&-sE Function: noun Inflected Form(s): plural -cies Etymology: Greek theokratia, from the- + -kratia -cracy 1 : government of a state by immediate divine guidance or by officials who are regarded as divinely guided 2 : a state governed by a theocracy"

The Afghani onstitution only says that in matters not covered by their law and constitution should leaders consult with Sharia law. There are no non-elected religious leaders in government positions. The religious heirarchy aren't going to get together to choose their next president.
You wasted your pell grant, I think.

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"Main Entry: de·moc·ra·cy Pronunciation: di-'mä-kr&-sE Function: noun Inflected Form(s): plural -cies Etymology: Middle French democratie, from Late Latin democratia, from Greek dEmokratia, from dEmos + -kratia -cracy 1 a : government by the people; especially : rule of the majority b : a government in which the supreme power is vested in the people and exercised by them directly or indirectly through a system of representation usually involving periodically held free elections 2 : a political unit that has a democratic government 3 capitalized : the principles and policies of the Democratic party in the U.S. 4 : the common people especially when constituting the source of political authority 5 : the absence of hereditary or arbitrary class distinctions or privileges"

You can keep right on making up definitions, but it makes us look like pigs to the people we urge to accept Democracy. It's sad when those irrational Bush haters that accused us of trying to impose our values on the world now are the ones whining that we aren't.

There is a UN document that sets out the rights a government must guarantee to be considered a democracy. Today the Sec of State was discussing that on Meet the Press and Chris Mathews. One of those freedoms that MUST be guaranteed is Religious Freedom. Given the concepts that our country is based upon, we CAN NOT support governments that would put to death a person for changing their religion. We have helped create three Theocracies in Iraq, Afghanistan and Palestine that violate the most basic freedom upon which our society is predicated. To support governments like in Afghanistan, Iraq and Palestine would be to turn our backs on our most basic principals which we hold as UNIVERSAL!

You're right, the entire principle of a modern democracy rests in the respect of fundamental rights while giving an active role to the population. You simply CANNOT participate actively in a democracy without basic fundament rights.

It's alarming that they would even consider what is going on in Afghanistan acceptable and democratic just because an apparent simple majority of the population accepts it. If, to make a hyperbolic comparison, the majority of Americans would want to reduce the rights of African-Americans, would it be acceptable and democratic?

This is the UN doument:

http://www.unhchr.ch/html/menu3/b/o_nonnat.htm Declaration on the Human Rights of Individuals Who are not Nationals of the Country in which They Live Adopted by General Assembly resolution 40/144 of 13 December 1985 The General Assembly, Considering that the Charter of the United Nations encourages universal respect for and observance of the human rights and fundamental freedoms of all human beings, without distinction as to race, sex, language or religion, Considering that the Universal Declaration of Human Rights proclaims that all human beings are born free and equal in dignity and rights and that everyone is entitled to all the rights and freedoms set forth in that Declaration, without distinction of any kind, such as race, colour, sex, language, religion, political or other opinion, national or social origin, property, birth or other status, Considering that the Universal Declaration of Human Rights proclaims further that everyone has the right to recognition everywhere as a person before the law, that all are equal before the law and entitled without any discrimination to equal protection of the law, and that all are entitled to equal protection against any discrimination in violation of that Declaration and against any incitement to such discrimination, Being aware that the States Parties to the International Covenants on Human Rights undertake to guarantee that the rights enunciated in these Covenants will be exercised without discrimination of any kind as to race, colour, sex, language, religion, political or other opinion, national or social origin, property, birth or other status, Conscious that, with improving communications and the development of peaceful and friendly relations among countries, individuals increasingly live in countries of which they are not nationals, Reaffirming the purposes and principles of the Charter of the United Nations, Recognizing that the protection of human rights and fundamental freedoms provided for in international instruments should also be ensured for individuals who are not nationals of the country in which they live, Proclaims this Declaration: Article 1 For the purposes of this Declaration, the term "alien" shall apply, with due regard to qualifications made in subsequent articles, to any individual who is not a national of the State in which he or she is present. Article 2 1. Nothing in this Declaration shall be interpreted as legitimizing the illegal entry into and presence in a State of any alien, nor shall any provision be interpreted as restricting the right of any State to promulgate laws and regulations concerning the entry of aliens and the terms and conditions of their stay or to establish differences between nationals and aliens. However, such laws and regulations shall not be incompatible with the international legal obligations of that State, including those in the field of human rights. 2. This Declaration shall not prejudice the enjoyment of the rights accorded by domestic law and of the rights which under international law a State is obliged to accord to aliens, even where this Declaration does not recognize such rights or recognizes them to a lesser extent. Article 3 Every State shall make public its national legislation or regulations affecting aliens. Article 4 Aliens shall observe the laws of the State in which they reside or are present and regard with respect the customs and traditions of the people of that State. Article 5 1. Aliens shall enjoy, in accordance with domestic law and subject to the relevant international obligation of the State in which they are present, in particular the following rights: (a) The right to life and security of person; no alien shall be subjected to arbitrary arrest or detention; no alien shall be deprived of his or her liberty except on such grounds and in accordance with such procedures as are established by law; ( The right to protection against arbitrary or unlawful interference with privacy, family, home or correspondence; (c) The right to be equal before the courts, tribunals and all other organs and authorities administering justice and, when necessary, to free assistance of an interpreter in criminal proceedings and , when prescribed by law, other proceedings; (d) The right to choose a spouse, to marry, to found a family; (e) The right to freedom of thought, opinion, conscience and religion; the right to manifest their religion or beliefs, subject only to such limitations as are prescribed by law and are necessary to protect public safety, order, health or morals or the fundamental rights and freedoms of others; (f) The right to retain their own language, culture and tradition; (g) The right to transfer abroad earnings, savings or other personal monetary assets, subject to domestic currency regulations. 2. Subject to such restrictions as are prescribed by law and which are necessary in a democratic society to protect national security, public safety, public order, public health or morals or the rights and freedoms of others, and which are consistent with the other rights recognized in the relevant international instruments and those set forth in this Declaration, aliens shall enjoy the following rights: (a) The right to leave the country; ( The right to freedom of expression; (c) The right to peaceful assembly; (d) The right to own property alone as well as in association with others, subject to domestic law. 3. Subject to the provisions referred to in paragraph 2, aliens lawfully in the territory of a State shall enjoy the right to liberty of movement and freedom to choose their residence within the borders of the State. 4. Subject to national legislation and due authorization, the spouse and minor or dependent children of an alien lawfully residing in the territory of a State shall be admitted to accompany, join and stay with the alien. Article 6 No alien shall be subjected to torture or to cruel, inhuman or degrading treatment or punishment and, in particular, no alien shall be subjected without his or her free consent to medical or scientific experimentation. Article 7 An alien lawfully in the territory of a State may be expelled therefrom only in pursuance of a decision reached in accordance with law and shall, except where compelling reasons of national security otherwise require, be allowed to submit the reasons why he or she should not be expelled and to have the case reviewed by, and be represented for the purpose before, the competent authority or a person or persons specially designated by the competent authority. Individual or collective expulsion of such aliens on grounds of race, colour, religion, culture, descent or national or ethnic origin is prohibited. Article 8 1 . Aliens lawfully residing in the territory of a State shall also enjoy, in accordance with the national laws, the following rights, subject to their obligations under article 4: (a) The right to safe and healthy working conditions, to fair wages and equal remuneration for work of equal value without distinction of any kind, in particular, women being guaranteed conditions of work not inferior to those enjoyed by men, with equal pay for equal work; ( The right to join trade unions and other organizations or associations of their choice and to participate in their activities. No restrictions may be placed on the exercise of this right other than those prescribed by law and which are necessary, in a democratic society, in the interests of national security or public order or for the protection of the rights and freedoms of others; (c) The right to health protection, medical care, social security, social services, education, rest and leisure, provided that they fulfil the requirements under the relevant regulations for participation and that undue strain is not placed on the resources of the State. 2. With a view to protecting the rights of aliens carrying on lawful paid activities in the country in which they are present, such rights may be specified by the Governments concerned in multilateral or bilateral conventions. Article 9 No alien shall be arbitrarily deprived of his or her lawfully acquired assets. Article 10 Any alien shall be free at any time to communicate with the consulate or diplomatic mission of the State of which he or she is a national or, in the absence thereof, with the consulate or diplomatic mission of any other State entrusted with the protection of the interests of the State of which he or she is a national in the State where he or she resides.

There is a UN document that sets out the rights a government must guarantee to be considered a democracy.

The UN doesn't get to arbitrarily "define" a democracy, Col. Don't you find it ironic that an international organization whose representatives are NOT Democratically chosen (when did you participate in the election for UN Representatives, Col?) would be able to unilaterally define "democracy" in defiance of its literal, political, and historical meaning?

What I find unbelievable is that ANY American would argue in favor of the total lack of individual freedom that is part of any government that is predicated on Islamic Law. There is NO justification for putting to death someone that has changed their religious belief! The UN declaration is the WORLD standard and it is OUR standard. How can we send our military to die and help establish a government that would put to death one of their citizens that changes their religion is indefensible. Unless these new governments in Afghanistan, Iraq and Palestine abandon these Islamic concepts, we MUST walk away from them. Bush has got himself a first class problem which stems from his failure to understand the culture of these people. Be careful what you ask for. Bush sent our military to enable these people to choose a government and now we can not live with the choices they have made.

Sad, Col. Do you even read what you post? The UN doesn't define Democracy. What you posted was:

"Declaration on the Human Rights of Individuals Who are not Nationals of the Country in which They Live"

odd... there isn't anything about democracy in what you cite. Nor is it required for membership in the UN, since there are even members of the security council that don't provide those protections, and many that aren't even democracies. I have a feeling the guy you are talking about IS a national of Afghanistan, having lived there all his life. If you want to go into why the UN standards on treatment of non-nationals has anything to do with this, feel free.

"The UN declaration is the WORLD standard and it is OUR standard."

The UN lets nations that work TOTALLY under Sharia law in. Afghanistan only supplements their laws when the topic isn't specifically covered. But you're right. It is OUR standard, not the Afghani standard, and in a Democracy you should be able to create your own standard, right?

I think you are a sick little man, Col. You tangle yourself up in so many directions that on one blog you can condemn us for imposing our will and on the next curse us for not imposing it hard enough.

I'm not arguing for a lack of freedom, I'm arguning that we keep our word and allow the people of Afghanistan to rule themselves, and not be the puppets of morons in America who would dress them in top hats and teach them to drink tea with their pinky raised. Pig.