Reply By: Daiwa Posted: Sunday, October 28, 2007
That's the difference between us, Gene.

You say, "When Congress sets the spending we MUST set taxes equal to that spending!!!!!"

I say, "When Congress sets taxes we MUST set spending to equal those taxes." NOT TRUE!!!


That is not what takes place. NEEDS not existing tax revenue MUST set spending levels. We have to provide for the security of this country. We have to keep the promises made to the baby boomers to pay their retirement and medical. We also have other programs that the MJORITY WANT (Will of the majority). When we have completed that process we need to determine the COST and MUST Fund that cost. We do not say well the tax revenue will only fund defense and Social Security so we will have to forget Medicare. The answer is we adjust the tax revenue to FULLY FUND what we collectively have decided are the needs of the country. That is what Congress is charged to do under the Constitution. It is not up to the President to set spending. What CAN NOT continue is setting spending ABOVE tax revenue!!!!!!! When Congress establishes the spending, taxes MUST equal those spending choices!

Reply By: danielost Posted: Sunday, October 28, 2007
NO the taxes for MOST will go DOWN. Taxes will increase on those that got the BIG benefits from the Bush tax Cuts and who can afford to pay a little more to help the MASSES AS WELL AS help SPENDING AND THE OVERALL ECONOMY!




taxes will go up


taxes will go up


taxes will go up

spending will go up

spending will go up

spending will go up


The past 7 years have proven you WRONG.

TAXES HAVE GONE DOWN!

SPENDING HAS GONE UP!

you mean that majority of 30,000 in San Fransisco that protested the war yesterday. the last time i heard there were 800,000 living in that city. of course that was 20 years ago. during the 1989 earth quake.

no it hasn't.


you were talking about the democrats not raising taxes. the democrats live to raise taxes. and spending is always going up even if you do away with pork. the democrats think all of these entitlement programs have to go up 8% every year no matter what. so tell oh grand puppa of crap how long will the schip program stay at 20 billion a year. thats right one year.

Reply By: danielost Posted: Sunday, October 28, 2007
“you mean that majority of 30,000 in San Francisco that protested the war yesterday. the last time i heard there were 800,000 living in that city. of course that was 20 years ago. during the 1989 earth quake.”


NO I mean the majority of the Congress who under OUR Constitution is elected by the people and who have the responsibility to set the spending for this country! This is very clear if you READ our Constitution! Neither you nor Bush have must have read it!

Reply By: danielost Posted: Sunday, October 28, 2007
You mean that majority of 30,000 in San Francisco that protested the war yesterday. The last time I heard there were 800,000 living in that city. Of course that was 20 years ago. During the 1989 earth quake.
Bonus Rating: Trolling Insightful





“Reply By: danielost Posted: Sunday, October 28, 2007
The past 7 years have proven you WRONG.

TAXES HAVE GONE DOWN!

SPENDING HAS GONE UP!




No it hasn't.” You are NUTS. Bush cut taxes 3 times and spending under BUSH HAS INCREASED FASTER THEN UNDER any other president! He has spent almost $4 Trillion more then we taxed.

“You were talking about the democrats not raising taxes. The democrats live to raise taxes. And spending is always going up even if you do away with pork. The democrats think all of these entitlement programs have to go up 8% every year no matter what. so tell oh grand puppa of crap how long will the schip program stay at 20 billion a year. thats right one year.” The last tax increase was Bush 41 you IDIOT!

As usual you do not know what you are talking about.

First, Social Security benefits have only increased by the cost of living. In your 8 % ( I do not know how accurate that is) but if that includes the fact that MORE people are receiving benefits that is only keeping the promises that were made not any increase. The biggest actual entitle increase was the Prescription Drug Plan that became law ONLY because of Bush and the GOP in Congress. They increased that entitlement without coming up with the money to pay for it.

The budget is about $2.8 Trillion. Of that about $2 trillion are promises that have been made and as such can not be cut. For example, the almost $500 Billion in interest on the debt. If we stopped paying all that interest we would have a balanced budget. Problem is the U.S. has promised to pay that interest. The same is true of pensions for military and civilian workers who have retired. There is a PROMISE to pay those benefits. We have Social Security Medicare that are promises made and as such not open to cuts. That leaves about $800 Billion of what is termed " Discretionary Spending" Included in that is National Defense, FBI and Justice, Homeland Security, Medicaid, VA, Intelligence and the operations of the government itself such as Treasury, National Parks, Transportation, Health etc. The truth is there is a very limited amount that can actually be cut. Defense, Homeland Security, VA, Justice (FBI), Treasury, Intelligence make up the vast majority of the so called discretionary spending.

People who say just cut the budget have not looked at what makes up the budget. We can not stop Defense, homeland security and any of those departments. In fact spending on defense, Homeland security and VA will be increasing given the increased danger we are facing. The $2.0 Trillion of mandatory spending is not available to cut. That money has been promised. We need to face the problem of bringing our revenue equal to the spending—For Both the Promises we have made and for the essential discretionary items like defense, Border Security etc. I doubt we can cut more then about $50-$75 Billion from the Discretionary spending. Spending under mandatory spending will continue to increase because of the upcoming Baby Boomer retirement. The first Baby Boomer will begin receiving Social Security in February 2008!

oh you mean that vast majority of people 68% that want to stay in Iraq as long as it isn't more than two more years.

Why wait? Cuba accepts immigrants, to my knowledge.

Reply By: Gideon MacLeish Posted: Sunday, October 28, 2007
I can not wait for this badly needed change!


Why wait? Cuba accepts immigrants, to my knowledge.


Be My Guest Go to Cuba anytime you want!






Reply By: danielost Posted: Sunday, October 28, 2007
NO I mean the majority of the Congress who under OUR Constitution is elected by the people and who have the responsibility to set the spending for this country!


oh you mean that vast majority of people 68% that want to stay in Iraq as long as it isn't more than two more years.

The subject is the tax cuts proposed by the democrats.

what tax cuts. the only thing i have heard is tax raises to pay for more spending. lets see universal health care(the new improved schip.). 5000 to every new born baby toward a college fund. a new home for everyone who doesn't have one. i believe Hillary also wants to give 1000 to every new born baby for retirement.


and how do you pay for any of this why you raise taxes.

I'm not the communist in the group. I was just thinking you'd feel more at home there, comrade!

Once again gene, who should we believe?  Actual business owners who the taxes really affect, or you, who has no clue about what goes on in real world economics.

 

Raising taxes on the rich will not fund all the socialist programs that democrats are already proposing.

What programs are those?  Are you saying that we should create more wasteful government programs because you think people supposedly want them? 

 

 

 

"We also have other programs that the MJORITY WANT (Will of the majority).

What programs are those? Are you saying that we should create more wasteful government programs because you think people supposedly want them? "


The Vast majority want us to defend our country including the border. That will take added resources for DoD Homeland Security, Coast Guard and flies in the face of "CUT SPENDING" for those areas which make up the majority of the Discretionary spending.

The Vast majority want to pay the promised benefits to the retired. That means we will need to ADD money in the future to pay both Social Security and Medicare Benefits.

The increase in the Debt means that the annual interest will go up by about $200 Billion because of what Bush added to the National Debt.

Most Americans believe everyone should have the ability to be covered with health insurance. Millions of middle income working families can not afford $7-8,000 per year for health insurance premium and just providing the tax credits Bush and other GOP presidential candidates propose will not help most that can NOT afford health insurance.

When you take an honest look at the Budget you will find CUTS in the discretionary portion will never come close to a balanced budget and provide the money to pay back the Debt. The $2 Trillion of mandatory (Look up the meaning of that word) can not be cut. Thus without ADDED TAX Revenue, we have NO hope to balance the budget much less begin repaying over $9 Trillion on the National Debt!!!!!!!

Ok, I will agree with that gene, but tell me what the democrats plan for this is.  You keep obsessing with Bush and the GOP, what are democrats going to do about it?




Where do you get this "most" thing from?  And you are still using numbers that do not reflect the reality.  Do you want socialized healthcare?  Do you want the government to take care of every need gene?  If Americans want government paid healthcare then raise taxes on everyone who will receive it

I mean seriously.  All you do is whine and complain about how the government doesn't help someone with everything. 


.

You have been shown several times how raising taxes is not the answer to everything.  Why you think the government will spend additional money wisely is beyond me.  You just want an excuse to tax successful people.

I notice you are still avoiding these posts:  https://forums.joeuser.com/?forumid=3&aid=166247

Nearly 90% already have that ability. I'm sure if you are a health insurance executive, that additional 10% looks pretty tempting - particularly when you consider most of them are people who don't need or use it. Skip the whole illegal alien crap, BTW.